DT 30358

105 comments on “DT 30358”

1. This puzzle’s parents were certainly not married, and it was a tough one at that!
   Immensely enjoyable but took two visits to get the last two clues in the SE corner, namely 25a and the last one for me, the absolutely brilliant 15d, best clue in yonks.
   Thought it was going to be an Xless pangram halfway through, but like Godot the Q never showed up. Many thanks to our setter for this supreme test of the grey cells, great fun.

   1. Love that opening comment

      1. Me too 😊.

2. It’s 4*/2.5* from me for a challenging but mainly enjoyable puzzle.

   I assumed I’d missed something with 4a, but I see that Mr K had a similar concern so, unless someone can come up with something better, I think it qualifies for a hmm. I’m also not overly keen on 5d.

   On the plus side, 10a is a brilliant triple definition, and it is joined by 17a & 15d on my podium.

   Many thanks to the setter and to Mr K.

   1. One of the few I solved was 5d, only because we had a similar clue before and I remembered it.

3. Inspired and ingenuous clueing
   Throughout.
   But what hard work!
   Deeply mined the grey matter to
   An unassisted finish.
   Can’t believe it!
   COTD without doubt, 5d.
   So, double 5*s.
   Many thanks to the setter and Mr K.

4. Way past my pay grade and has no place on the back page.

   1. yes it does

      1. Sorry, I agree with Andrew.

5. As appropriate for a Friday, this was by far the biggest challenge of the week.

   After quite some time I only had two or three of the few easier answers until I cracked 9d which helped greatly. Some ladies from 24a were on the TV playing football at the time which also assisted.

   Cannot parse 4a either but nothing else sensible fits.

   See 5d is getting a mixed reception but it was my COTD.

   Thanks to the setter and Mr K for his explanation of 25a which was my LOI.

6. A very demanding puzzle, which i stared at uncomprehendingly for some time before getting a handful of clues, one in each corner. Gradually it fell into place . The triple definition at 4a was very clever indeed and oins the humorous 14a as my joint COTD’S .5d was a good cryptic definition and9d a great anagram too. It was most satisfying t finish this monster guzzle unaided. Thanks to the compiler and to Mr K for the hints.

   1. 10a not 4a for the triple definition

7. Phew, that was a slog! 25a held up the final entry.
   24a luckily jumped off the page as ‘item’ didn’t help. Misdirection?
   I wouldn’t want this level of difficulty every day that is certain.
   Thanks to setter.

8. Certainly challenging but very enjoyable – thanks to the setter and Mr K.
   Ticks from me for 13a, 25a and 5d with my favourite being 15d.

9. Took a while to get started and it soon materialised that this puzzle was of toughie standard!.and a ****/*** for me.
   favourites were 20d and 10a.liked the hidden definitions in the SW corner.
   not raining yet in manchester.

10. I found this very difficult but with 7or 8 still unsolved I accidentally hit the reveal all button. But I will hold my hand up and admit I would never have solved 15d, 22d, 25a and 27a. Not much fun but thanks anyway. I’m high as a kite on pain killers as I’ve tweaked something in my back so this was a helpful distraction.

    1. Oh poor you. My back is bothering me at the moment I am wondering about Pilates?

       1. Pilates is well worth a try, Daisy. If you enjoy yoga, Pilates is very similar. I do a mix of stretches, PIlates and yoga, usung my yoda mat. Some yoga positions a impossible if you have two full knee replacements and two full hip replacements like me. I can so most of the Pilates exercises and it’s great for balance too

       2. DG

          I’ve been doing Pilates for over a year now and can absolutely recommend it …..especially but not only for ….. a poorly back.

          I have 1 to 1 sessions and I think I get more from them than classes but that may be a personal thing.

          Good luck

    2. You have my sympathy regarding your back, Manders. I did something serious to mine back in January. The pain was bad but the worst part was when the back muscles went into spasm. I hope you get better soon. :rose:

       1. That’s it exactly Steve – it keeps going into spasms. It was really stupid, I was trying to attach the washing line to a tree and I was just a bit too short and kept stretching and stretching to try and hook it on and then ping! Still the strong Co-codamol are helping but I do feel a bit away with the fairies. The trouble with being 5ft 3 married to someone just over 6ft – he always puts things too high up. I got him to hang out the towels this morning and then he whacked me in the face with the clothes line prop, not intentionally, so having a really good day watching the start of a black eye!

          1. The muscle spasms hit me at night. I spent three nights on my back not daring to move in case my back cramped. It was exceedingly painful and I hit the co-codamol hard.

             You really do have my sympathy and I am thinking of you.

             Your comment about the clothes line reminded me of my Mum in Law. One Christmas Eve she had a couple of glasses of sherry at a neighbour’s house. She did not drink so felt quite squiffy. However, when she went home she decided to hang the washing out on the line She took the basket of washing out, pulled the line down then let go of it while she got an item of washing from the laundry basket. Of course, when she turned round to hang the item on the line it had gone out of reach. She put the item of clothing back in the basket and pulled the line down again. She let go of the line and picked up the item of clothing from the basket only to find the line had gone out of reach once more. My Father in Law told me he watched his wife trying to hang out the washing like this for a good half hour.

             1. After I fell and landed up in hospital, my back went into spasms too, to my right just under my waist. I could feel the muscles tighten up and contract, screaming with pain, then relaxing. They had to give me morphine for the pain. After I came home, I gradually could get in the pool and do exercises. I have not had one spasm since then, I try to get in every day. I know having a pool in your backyard is not possible, but is there a community pool? Or get some exercises that could do the same?

11. Well, I completed it but can’t say I derived any pleasure from the task.
    Not to worry, tomorrow’s another day.

    Thanks to our setter – Zandio I reckon – and to Mr K sans felines for the review.

12. I’ve recently been able to get to four away from completing these puzzles before heading to the hints (although with help from the thesaurus / dictionary). I was six away with this one, and there was a lot of strain getting there. I have introduced a personal rule by which use of an unindicated Americanism attracts an automatic -* enjoyment penalty, which this puzzle qualifies for. I got 9d, but thanks to spotting the anagram – I didn’t like the definition. If Mr K had trouble parsing 4a, what hope had I, but for what it’s worth, I think Mr K seems right. I spotted the answer to 24a, but I don’t really follow how the answer fits the definition. 25a is, to me, deep into crosswordland; not sure ordinary people would read ‘essentially’ in the way it is used, although I suspect this clue might be appreciated by the experts. But the relative ease with which I picked up on 7d gave me encouragement. I found this puzzle a grind, which knocked the enjoyment out of it. I agree with Mr K about the difficulty: ****. Enjoyment is very subjective, but it’s a 0* for me [penalty deduction applied].

    Thanks for the hints Mr K.

    1. Take care, the next step after making A Rule might be the formation of A List and then you really are in trouble. Do you like bits in your orange juice?

       1. Yes, I do like bits in Orange juice! How did you guess? Does that put me on a list!? 😉

          1. Terence is the Master of The List and loathes bits in his O J with an abnormal passion. I love him dearly but we cannot have two of him. If you like ‘bits’ you are in no danger of stepping on his toes.

             1. Are that’s good! I’m the opposite – orange juice isn’t ‘real’ orange unless its got bits in! I now realise why you capitalised the ‘A’ before ‘List’ – Terence is Master of ‘The’ List.

    2. I imagine there may at some point be a number of cryptic experts who enjoy two tough crosswords on a Friday swaggering about how doable this is and enjoyable it is and this is how Friday really should be. I’m guessing perhaps they might feel owed two crosswords that are inaccessible to many today because there’s no Toughie on a Monday. This is why I would like to see a quickie cryptic in the DT. There’d be something for everyone on a Friday.

       1. All of that would get my vote. Friday is generally pointless for me, in every sense, so far as the back-page crossword is concerned.

       2. You said it all. Thanks.

       3. Succinct and brilliantly, totally agree.

13. Unpleasantly hard with hugely complex clues inc one of the worst I have seen for a while in 25a.
    Def an escaped Toughie. Having completed it by dint of looking for any sort of definition then ignoring the rest of the wordplay, my opinion of this puzzle is not publishable.
    *****/0
    Thx for the hints in explaining the answers.

14. WOW , don’t normally comment these days but proud to say I finished it !! Thanks Mr K

15. Certainly tough, but it is Friday. I don’t usually love anagrams but 14A and 9D were absolute peaches. There’s something for everyone here – lurker, &Lit, etc. Apart from the old chestnut at 12A, some unique and clever delights. Wasn’t crazy on 4A but I have no doubt Mr K is right. I’m with RD – definitely a hmm. But very enjoyable. Thanks to all.

16. I just cannot get a handle on this and have given up.

17. Thought this a very tricky and difficult puzzle to work through. Wasn’t really my cuppa today.
    Still have four not done so a DNF for me.

    4*/2.5*

    Favourites include 4a, 14a, 17a & 23a with winner 14a

    Thanks to setter and Mr K for hints/blog

18. This was so far above my head it was in outer space! Not my cup of tea I’m afraid.

    Thanks to the setter for a sound beating. Thank, Mr. K for the hints and making sense of it for me.

    1. Glad to see you back. I only got one answer on my own 😓.

       1. Thanks, BL. I did post yesterday but not until later in the day.

    2. I’m with you all the way. A tough Toughie at the least.

19. A tough, but very enjoyable, challenge! With only four solved on my initial pass, I was unsure but, as the answers came together, I though it was a great “Friday” puzzle. Many thanks to the setter for the cluing but, especially, for my COTD, the brilliant 15D.

20. Not my cup of tea at all and I struggled to find the setter’s wavelength so “challenging”, as MrK says, and my progress was bumpy. Agree with RD’s reservation re 4a and 5d but would in fact add several more hmms. 15d gets a special mention from me for its craft. Thank you Mysteron (Zandio?) and MrK.

21. Chewy, testing, and absolutely spot-on for a Friday backpager. I’d been thinking ProXimal but come the end there were still two other letters missing, and I’m happy to echo Jane’s crediting of this puzzle to Zandio.

    Clues were generally impeccably fair and once each penny had dropped there was a corresponding “Doh! Why didn’t I see that sooner” sort of feeling. Some great surface reads, and for a testing puzzle this one manages to put the obscurity into the clueing, not the answers – no left-field GK required at any point.

    So many great clues, where to start? 1a (lovely surface), 13a, the surfaces & anagrams of 14a and 9d, 15a, 25a, 2d … and I juist can’t decide between 15d & 20d for COTD.

    4* / 5*

    Super, super crossword – thank you Zandio (presumably) and Mr K

22. Hello, compiler here, greetings from stormy Venice. Thanks for taking the time to solve, analyse and discuss.
    I liked 4a. I can say that because it’s not really my clue — it’s more or less straight out of Chambers.
    Have a great weekend.

    1. It may have been hard (who am I kidding, it was hard) but it was brilliant. Thank you so much, I love anagrams and there were particularly sweet.

    2. Having looked at Chambers, I still cannot make head nor tail of 4a 😉

       1. If your version of Chambers is the same as mine, maybe have a close look at the heading for the 4a entry in it, rather than definitions 1. and 2. under it.

          1. Thanks – My edition is dated 1994. I suspect that you and the compiler have a more recent one with a different definition.

    3. Thank you for the puzzle, Zandio but way too difficult for me, I’m afraid. I’ll get on your wavelength one day.

23. Really cracking crossword that took a lot of graft to unravel! Very enjoyable, so many thanks. Can make no sense of 4a, but after getting the checkers it couldn’t be anything else!

24. What a fantastic guzzle! It took me absolutely ages to get started, so for once, I was grateful for the long anagram at 5d and the given at 17a. I couldn’t fully parse 4a, but I see now that that is par for the course. I didn’t really like 5d either. The definition seems a bit contrived. There was plenty to like, especially 10a, 13a, 15d and today’s favourite 25a. Thanks to our setter for the enjoyable workout and Mr K for the review.

25. Loved it. Concise clues with not a word wasted. The ”Lord of Lego”, that’s for sure!

    I wouldn’t look too much into 4a: it’s what Mr K says it is plus a surface (‘unit’ meaning ‘group of people’) to throw you off the scent or should that be ‘cent’ (not sorry).

    Tough to pick the medal winners but I’ll go with 6d and 9d with15d getting the nod as it’s very clever plus it was my LOI.

    Most enjoyable.

    3*/5*

26. I’m not normally a fan of Zandio’s puzzles, often finding them almost unsolvable (I’m often quite 1a about them!) BUT I managed to finish this one and even quite enjoyed it! There were a couple I wasn’t sure about, so thanks to Mr K for explaining. West went in fairly easily, east was more tricky but got there eventually.
    In my opinion, 5d should not appear in a crossword until at least the end of November…too early in the year to be thinking about that, even if it is 13 degrees and raining in North Lancashire!
    I don’t normally say this but thanks to Zandio for the puzzle.

27. I really enjoyed this struggle. I was on pangram alert when I saw a Z, V and J but it didn’t happen. 1a went in straight away which gave me a false sense of security but it gradually built up with the help of anagrams. For some reason 26a was my last one in. Many thanks for your hints Mr K – I have had a very busy week and so I am assuming you’ve not had much time either hence the lack of felines. I forgive you. This time. I have already thanked Zandio. Am now off to do a stint on the WI stall at the Picnic in the Park event which I think is going to be a bit of a damp squid (as my lovely Spanish sister in law used to say). Anyone for left over cake?

28. Fun Friday! Actually found it relatively doable even though it took breakfast and lunch (I don’t understand stars!).
    V many thanks to Zandio, enjoying one of my favourite cities, and to Mr K, particularly for pointing out that “worn by” can mean “containing” (as in 22d) when I was sure it was the opposite!

29. Bit of a Toughie on the back page, but it is Friday. I enjoyed it. Luckily the Toughie for today is actually slightly more chewy than this one, so just a hard day all round I think.

30. Can’t say I really enjoyed the process, it felt like very hard work, but realising how clever so many of the clues were made it worthwhile.

    Thanks to Zandio and Mr K.

31. **** ? Ridiculously tough for a backpager. Why don’t the DT just come clean, and admit that there are now two Toughies on a Friday? Nothing for the lesser mortals. Note to self: do not print on Fridays, do not waste paper, do not waste ink, do not waste time. Go directly to Wordle. Congratulations to all who finish, but way above my head I’m afraid. Truly disappointing.

32. Tough but fair, given a reasonable aptitude for solving plus a bit of time to finish it. Many clues were candidates for the favourite slot, but 15d stood out for me.

    Many thanks to Zandio and Mr K.

    1. To be fair, I think you need more than a reasonable aptitude to solve a **** rated difficulty. Having solved these since 1969 I’d like to think I have “a reasonable aptitude”.

    2. Agreed, some of us have tiny brains and have less aptitude for solving, thanks for pointing that out. It still doesn’t explain the two Toughies on a Friday.
       P.S. I wonder how many have done the Toughie today?

    3. Assuming they all parse properly, I’m not sure what fairness has got to with the difficulty of the puzzles and therefore to ability – I assume even you will struggle where a crossword doesn’t parse properly. The back-pager and the Toughie should both be ‘fair’, although the Toughie is supposed to be tougher than the back-pager (otherwise what’s the point in calling it a Toughie). This back-pager was tough, certainly 4*, maybe 4.5*. It required more than ‘a reasonable aptitude for solving’ to finish unaided, ‘reasonable’ in this context meaning ‘moderate’. Today, elite solvers had this and the Toughie to play, while you can see from the comments that there were excellent solvers who had, in effect, nothing. Do you think that is ‘fair’?

       1. I did note that only six members of the intelligentsia commented on the Toughie, and YS was not one of them. If you want to know who the real brains are, see those who do the Toughie.

          1. And obviously the lovely people who take time out of their day to post the hints for us all. I take my hat off to them all the time.

          2. I had no time yesterday for two puzzles. I will find time for yesterday’s Toughie over the weekend.

             1. Just for the record, I have now completed Friday’s Toughie. Very difficult but just doable.

33. Difficult but doable with enough straightforward clues to help get the harder ones. All parsed except 4a. Despite making slow progress I rather enjoyed this. Favourite was 6d. Thanks to Zandio and Mr. K.

34. Good afternoon
    I see from the above that once again, I have been pitted against The Mind Of Zandio…well, I’m pleased to say that I made it, although the NE quadrant was a struggle, and I had to cheat by putting E***S*Y (13a) into a crozzie solver app.
    I too found 4a impossible to parse, though having read the Hints, I reckon Mr K has it right.
    Some definite reasons to go “Crikey!!” – 11a, which is a corker of a clue; 27a, 15d, and 13a – I have written OUCH! beside that one!
    My thanks to The Mind Of Zandio and to Mr K. Busy weekend, so I’ll be back on Monday, God willing.

35. Have broken off my , probably doomed, attempt to do this guzzle to protest about 2d.
    As the recipient of a sharp whack across the back of the legs with a ruler, I have never forgotten that adjectives QUALIFY nouns whilst adverbs MODIFY verbs
    Why it was so important to know this still escapes me.

    1. Ooh, well spotted. And I see Chambers agrees!

36. I have nothing further to add … it’s Zandio, ’nuff said. I’ll let this hare sit.

37. Difficult but finished without recourse to the hints but not sure whether I enjoyed it or not. 4a hmmm. Didn’t like 13 or 25 .
    I reiterate your sentiments Mark, two crosswords on Friday _ one easier than the other, plus the toughie. Thanks to all

38. Blimey, that was hard. I am amazed at our bloggers who can without fail produce the hints ready for the morning deadline. A mixture of online help and the hints and sort of got there in the end but some are way beyond my reach. Must add a few more bits to my orange (sorry Terrence).

39. What a difference a day makes. Yesterday I managed to solve all but one clue unaided. Today I’ve only managed to solve a grand total of 4 clues despite returning to it many times during the day. But thanks to the blogger and setter as always.

40. Late to this as out all day. Thoroughly enjoyed it & bar an inability to parse 4a & an almighty head scratch for 25a it all went in a sight quicker than some of this setter’s guzzles that I can recall. I do think TG’s difficult but doable comment very fair. I particularly liked all 4 long ‘uns, the triple def & the 24a lurker but my fav was last in 15d.
    Thanks to Zandio & to Mr K
    Ps Did think, in the absence of Elgar & Osmosis, there might be a doable Friday Toughie to have a bash at while watching the cricket & golf highlights but a quick glance at Dutch’s difficulty rating & Jane’s comment tells me there’s little point…..

41. I’ve been sitting for a while trying to work out the best way to comment. I really enjoyed this puzzle. I didn’t finish, about two thirds though then used a hint and saw where that led me.
    As far as I am concerned every day is a school day in crosswordland.
    Thanks entirely to this blog I have improved over the years to the point where I have actually finished the genius crossword in the Oldie, just one but it’s a start.
    I think my somewhat laboured point is that crosswords don’t deserve some of the cross words that we have seen.
    Thank you very much to all of the setters and bloggers.

    1. I like your penultimate paragraph, so true. We have this wonderful site to explain the construction of the clues plus a reveal button – what more can we ask for? I have so many other things to worry about outside Guzzle Land I am afraid I cannot get worked up about a guzzle. I am sure there must be other papers with different grades of difficulty.

       1. This site is great and instructive and long may it remain, but I imagine many if not most habitual solvers want to have a fair crack at a crossword before hints. On this day some excellent solvers were barely able to start any cryptic in the DT. Where will the DT crossword be if the non-experts or people who want something a bit lighter all migrate, say to the Times, which has a quick cryptic or the Guardian which I think also has a lighter offering and is free (online, the DT puzzles are separate from the news). Will it be a case of last out, turn off the lights? I imagine the DT will get real time figures about how their crosswords are faring from their app and website (which many of the people who can usually finish the Friday back-pager seem not to use). I would like to see a quick cryptic in the DT (particularly on a Friday), which would give everybody something to go at, although it might get rolling eyes from the experts. Would you oppose that?

42. Almost managed to solve without the hints, but 11a defeated me. I cannot see how the answer corresponds to masters. Google was no help. Happy to add to the memory banks, but it helps to know why they are synonyms.

    A very hard solve for me. I am surprised I persevered when I only had four clues solved in the time I often take to finish the whole crossword. Glad I did continue though, for the satisfaction of nearly solving a toughie.

    Thanks to all.

    1. In audio the original is the master copy

    2. Hi. Chambers, Oxford and Collins define a master as an original document, film, recording, etc from which copies are made.
       A report on the disastrous fire at Universal Studios Hollywood in 2008 says: “There were recordings from dozens of record companies that had been absorbed by Universal over the years, including several of the most important labels of all time. The vault housed tape masters for Decca, the pop, jazz and classical powerhouse; it housed master tapes for the storied blues label Chess; it housed masters for Impulse, the groundbreaking jazz label. The vault held masters for the MCA, ABC, A&M, Geffen and Interscope labels. And it held masters for a host of smaller subsidiary labels. Nearly all of these masters — in some cases, the complete discographies of entire record labels — were wiped out in the fire.”
       Thanks for taking the time to solve. All the best.

       1. I am very impressed you have taken the time to answer so thoroughly.

          Many thanks to you and Huntsman for your replies.

          I look forward to solving your next offering!

       2. Thanks for elucidation Zandio.

43. I’m in my early 80s and usually manage to finish the crossword before 11am. Recently though, I think the puzzles are becoming harder and especially today’s. I often use you and thank for your most enjoyable site.

    1. Welcome to the blog, Yorkie.
       Now that you’ve introduced yourself I hope that you’ll become a regular commenter.

    2. Welcome from me as well.

44. Just to say I enjoyed the challenge of Zandio’s puzzle today – I needed to revisit it a couple of times before the final clues fell into place – maybe this evening’s glass of Merlot helped! Favourite clue 17a – what a respectful term but one which seems largely to have gone by the wayside. LOI was 5d – definitely a penny drop moment. Many thanks to Zandio, Mr K et al.

45. SUPER puzzle. Perfect for a Friday, paired with the Ashes, and, for my second pass, some reasonable white Burgundy. I don’t comment here much but, freshly delighted and with the wine bottle empty, I’m now to bed.

    1. That sounds very satisfactory and vaguely Pepysian – if that is a word.

46. Usual Friday nightmare and impossible to solve, roll on Saturday

47. First time on here in about 10 years, had to remember it was Big Dave not Big Barry! Enjoying the Telegraph cryptic again having realised I can print off a PDF rather than buy the thing. Today was rather a slog but once I saw you professionals were struggling I breathed easy, relaxed, and finished it off. Thanks for the help with 4a to get back on track. 25a I’d never have got in a month. 24a, 27a, 9d were very clever.

    1. Welcome back, AgentB

       1. Thank you, and thank you for the hints! I was sorry to read about Dave on the homepage. I only used this site occasionally but remember the very earliest days here and was always amazed how he managed to finish every puzzle day-in day-out and get the hints up! Glad you’re keeping it going and have now set a bookmark 😁

48. To add my 4a worth to this lively blog, I agree this was a toughie but perseverantia vincit

49. I got through this very nicely until I couldn’t do 25a and 15d. I looked at the hint for the former which I would never have solved. I did then manage the latter. Favourites 27a and 2d.

50. As a bedtime puzzler on the cusp of making decent stabs at the easier Toughie offerings, I found this difficult but fair. But it wasn’t finished at lights out. A fresh mind in the morning electrified my performance and I finished with my favourite, 15d.

    1. Welcome to the blog, Tablemountain.
       Now that you’ve introduced yourself I hope that you’ll become a regular commenter.

51. I have never joined in the chat before, but after reading all the comments, I had to laugh. I finally only got stuck on 22d because I thought a word for ‘worn’ came after head of (c)lass. 4a I did get, but didn’t like it much. I am just pleased I got this far with a ****. Yay!!

52. As another bed-time puzzler I solved 1 clue and then gave up (it was the right answer!) When will our esteemed editor realise that we lesser mortals do not like a Toughie allocated to the space which is supposed to be a backpager? Thanks to all, especially Mr K who must have worked very hard to produce the hints.

53. A difficult puzzle which I solved over two days (I have the excuse that I still work full time) but nevertheless an enjoyable challenge, well worth the effort.

54. 5*/4* …..
    liked 15D “Decide whether to break up railway — or upgrade? (9)”

55. Love all the puzzles in the Telegraph. Hope they don’t change! Completed this one this morning. Always have a backlog! 4a certainly works if viewed in it’s entirety.

56. I know it’s a few days late but 100 hours after starting this puzzle I finally finished it! I came here to check a few parsings and read the comments. I quite like the occasional very difficult puzzle on a Friday so no complaints from me. It’s always nice to know one is not alone in finding a puzzle tough and I’m always amazed how going back to a puzzle over the space of a few days can make the previously unfathomable seem obvious – the human brain is a wonderful thing.
    Thanks to setter and hinter and all the commenters.

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