DT 26247 – Hints

Daily Telegraph Cryptic No 26247 – Hints

Big Dave’s Saturday Crossword Club

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The usual few hints to get you started.

Don’t forget that you can give your assessment of the puzzle. Five stars if you thought it was great, one if you hated it, four, three or two if it was somewhere in between.

As is usual for the weekend prize crosswords, I will select a few of the better clues and provide hints for them. Gnomethang’s full review of this puzzle will be published on Thursday, 27th May.


Across

1a    A defeat that is humiliating (8)
This looks at first sight to be a double definition, but you mustn’t ignore that initial A to which you need to add a defeat to get a word meaning humiliating

15a    Steal young animal having 40 winks (6)
The crime of “stealing” somebody is built up from a young animal and a short rest

28a    Showed the way after Lorne Turner was registered (8)
Put a word meaning showed the way after a anagram reversal, indicated by turner, of LORNE to get a synonym for was registered

Down

2d    Robin might come clean here (8)
You might have one of these in the garden

8d    Mineral from meadows, I left normal amount (8)
This abundant rock-forming mineral is constructed from another name for meadows, without the I (I left) combined with the normal amount of shots for a particular golf hole

17d    Trying badly (8)
A cryptic definition of appealing to someone, even if wrong or unwise

25d    Annoy Romeo on Corsica, say (4)
To get a word meaning to annoy combine the letter represented by Romeo in the NATO phonetic alphabet with the French for island (Corsica is an example)

The Saturday Crossword Club will open at 10.00 am (after Sounds of the Sixties on BBC Radio 2). Membership is free and open to all. Feel free to leave comments or ask questions before that time.

Please don’t put whole or partial answers in your comment, else they may be censored!

72 Comments

  1. Rupert
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 6:17 am | Permalink

    My rant for the day

    How can top solvers rack up 30,000 plus points a day? This week, we saw the top daily accumulation hit 70,000!
    Take the lower figure – 30,000. That’s 25 Toughies at 1,200 points each (so not allowing for the time bar of 24 hours to earn the Time Bonus on any one day). Maybe I’m slow, but it takes me around 45 to 60 minutes to solve most Toughies, so there are simply not enough hours in the day to earn 30,000 let alone 70,000 points.

    PS after the rant, this was a straightforward but pleasurable crossword. Nothing to eally excite yet nothing to annoy.

    PPS Still cannot The Bear Necessities out of my head from yesterday – “get with the beat baggy!”

    • Kram
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 11:43 am | Permalink

      Rupert, I made a similar comment/complaint to Cluedup many months ago, although they were aware of the problem, there was no way they could prove that there was any manipulation of the point scoring system by members!, they did put in a statement to say play by the rules, but obviously some people are above gamesmanship!.

    • Posted May 22, 2010 at 5:19 pm | Permalink

      There is a well-known bug on CluedUp which enables full time-bonus points on all archive crosswords, and presumably sudokus. I personally can’t be bothered with the points thing and don’t think many readers/contributors to Big Dave’s blog can either. It requires huge cheating to stay near the top of the page -utterly pointless bothering, because everyone knows……..

  2. Pamela
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 8:03 am | Permalink

    Oh Joy! Up early, downloaded from the internet and finished in about 25 minutes. This is the first time I have ever done it so quickly. Only one wobble when I read LONE instead of LORNE. It’s the way it prints out I think. Luckily my husband asked me who LORNE Turner was! Thanks for a puzzle that made my day.

    • Harry Shipley
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 8:11 am | Permalink

      Just a quickie. I think the first bit of 28a is a straight reversal, not an anagram, which makes the wordplay more precise.

      • Posted May 22, 2010 at 10:35 am | Permalink

        Thanks for that Harry. Since all reversals are also anagrams it was easy to miss. especially at 1:30 am!

  3. Franny
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 8:52 am | Permalink

    Yes, I got up earlyish and finished this along with my toast and marmalade — all except 26a, which I can only think is the name of a Roman poet, but don’t know why.

    Have a good weekend, everyone. :-)

    • gazza
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 8:58 am | Permalink

      26a Drop in from Italy (4)
      The definition is drop, and you need to check the letters in the rest of the clue.

      • Franny
        Posted May 22, 2010 at 9:46 am | Permalink

        Thanks, Gazza, but I don’t see what else 12d and 19d could be. I still have the first and third letters of that poet.

        • gazza
          Posted May 22, 2010 at 9:55 am | Permalink

          Franny
          It’s not a poet. It’s a hidden word meaning drop or leave out.

        • Pamela
          Posted May 22, 2010 at 10:30 am | Permalink

          What about LEAVE THE DUCK WITH THE GERMAN as an alternative clue?

          • Franny
            Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:26 pm | Permalink

            At last! Thanks so much, Gazza and Pamela — I was thinking of the noun rather than the verb. Now I can get on with my day.
            Good clue, Pamela. Are you on COW?
            :-)

          • Franny
            Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:32 pm | Permalink

            At last! Thanks so much, Gazza and Pamela — ‘in from’ threw me. Now I can get on with my day.
            Good clue, Pamela. Are you on COW?
            :-)

            • Pamela
              Posted May 22, 2010 at 2:13 pm | Permalink

              Sorry, I know nothing, I’m from near Barcelona. What is COW?

              • Posted May 22, 2010 at 2:46 pm | Permalink

                It’s Do-It-Yourself Clue Of The Week – let your eyes wander to the right of this page where you’ll see Clue Writing Competition.

                It’s the place to be and all are welcome regardless of experience.

          • Michael
            Posted May 22, 2010 at 3:22 pm | Permalink

            I prefer LEAVE DUCK WITH GERMAN otherwise it looks as if the answer contains “der”

            • Pamela
              Posted May 22, 2010 at 5:27 pm | Permalink

              But that’s the double whammy. If one didn’t have19d one might just think Oder and connect it with a German River and without thinking it through put that in as the answer. That’s why I did add “the”. Never mind eh? Franny completed the crossword.

  4. Posted May 22, 2010 at 10:04 am | Permalink

    I too finished this early [although I buy the paper] and was amused by 2d as my robin has already made use of the ******** sending spray flying into the early morning sunshine. It is probably the best birthday present my Dear Beloved has ever bought for me.

  5. Little Dave
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 10:33 am | Permalink

    Isn’t 8d one word? I think the desired 4,4 answer is wrong. Would like to hear views of any geologists!

    • Posted May 22, 2010 at 10:45 am | Permalink

      If you click on the picture it takes you to the Wikipedia article about the mineral. I checked this in two dictionaries (Chambers and ODE) and the only alternate spelling I can find is that the fourth letter may be omitted.

    • tilly
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 11:21 am | Permalink

      Chambers on-line Word Wizard has it as one word.

    • Pamela
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 2:17 pm | Permalink

      My early morning download had it as one word of 8 letters, not 4,4.

  6. Little Dave
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 10:39 am | Permalink

    Is it just me but 9a is puzzling or am I a bit slow on the uptake this side of the day?

    • Posted May 22, 2010 at 10:49 am | Permalink

      It’s the posh name for what is dropped by Cockneys.

      • Rupert
        Posted May 22, 2010 at 1:35 pm | Permalink

        Cricket balls????

  7. Little Dave
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 10:51 am | Permalink

    Thanks BD – still stumped!!!

    • Posted May 22, 2010 at 10:54 am | Permalink

      To quote from Chambers:

      “To pronounce with a full breathing, i.e. the sound of h, as in house

      • Pamela
        Posted May 22, 2010 at 2:25 pm | Permalink

        Alternative clue :- Dropping silently like Jack Sparrow.

        • Posted May 22, 2010 at 2:32 pm | Permalink

          Please stick as closely as possible to the actual wordplay at weekends. If we start allowing alternative wordplays then the result will be chaotic. We will have a lot of comments along the lines of “think of xyz” which may help with the answer but not the actual wordplay in the clue.

  8. digby
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:00 pm | Permalink

    Not being a subscriber to CluedUp I have no idea what all the ranting is about. But, judging by all the negative comments I read about it on this Blog, I suggest that malcontents vote with their cash and take out a subscription to the paper version. A gentle stroll through the village to collect it; an invigorating coffee; do the crossword; send it off; then make a comment on the blog. A bit on the easy side today, but not too bad for a Saturday.

    • Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:42 pm | Permalink

      Unfortunately my village shop is not open at midnight, nor on Sundays.

      The points table is a side issue. Most, if not all, of the top twenty or thirty cheat by using a loophole to secure bonus points for out-of-date puzzles, and a lot of them use this blog for their answers. As such the table is useless and is best ignored. Let the cheats play their silly game and use the website for online access to the puzzles. Changes to the site are due very soon, so I await with interest how many loopholes are to be closed.

      For those who don’t know, if you open a puzzle, save it, exit and come back in again you get the full bonus points however old the puzzle and however long you take. There are other loopholes that are best forgotten.

      • digby
        Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:51 pm | Permalink

        Big Dave – fair point, well made. Why not move to Heavenly Henfield? 6 good pubs within walking distance!

  9. Dim Dave
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:09 pm | Permalink

    This was a nice little cerebral jog after the sat morning physical jog. Only one that gave me a headache was 20a-never heard of it. Favourite clue was 1d just for the mental image.

    • Pamela
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 2:31 pm | Permalink

      Reading historical novels helped me on that one!

  10. Kath
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:14 pm | Permalink

    Maybe I’m being particularly dim this morning but can’t make head or tail of 21a – have alternate letters and STILL can’t even think of a word that would fit, let alone have any relevance to the clue. Any hints gratefully received!

    • Claire
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:22 pm | Permalink

      It’s a tye of blue (that artists use) – soft is the normal crosswordland letter and red is not really a colour

    • Kath
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 1:25 pm | Permalink

      Thank you Claire – could have spent a long time mithering about that!

  11. Spindrift
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:19 pm | Permalink

    20a is one of those words whose continuing existence is owed to crossword compilers!
    Finished but not happy with my answers for 27a & 17d

  12. Claire
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:33 pm | Permalink

    A good crossword for us and managed with just a couple of hints (not heard of 8d). Amazing! My only grouse today is 23a which, in my very humble opinion, should have been clued discovery rather than decision. Maybe that’s because I’m still very firmly seated in the CC! Favourites 1a, 28a &2d. Off out to enjoy more sun & maybe a stab at NTSPP :-)

    • gazza
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 12:58 pm | Permalink

      Claire, I agree with you on 23a.

    • Posted May 22, 2010 at 1:13 pm | Permalink

      Chambers Thesaurus has discovery and plenty more to choose from – but not decision. I had sufficient checking letters that the answer was obvious, so I didn’t dwell too long on this, but I too agree with you.

      • Posted May 22, 2010 at 1:43 pm | Permalink

        Could you email the clue/answer to 23a Dave?

    • prolixic
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

      I think that the answer in terms of an “important decision” can just about be justified if you think of the word when used in the context of negotiations between parties that are at loggerheads when a **** may be made in the negotiations when they are able to make important decisions where previously they have disagreed. Only partially convincing, methinks!

  13. Peter
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 1:23 pm | Permalink

    Gosh what a rotter.

    Have got wrong answers to 1a, 9a.

    Cannot do 13a, 17a,20a, 21a, 23a, 27a, 14d,17d,24d!!

    • Kath
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 1:56 pm | Permalink

      Having received SO much help since discovering this blog maybe it’s time to give something back!
      13a Think wartime sort of restrict
      17a Right (of ownership)
      20a It’s one of those that’s in the clue
      21a See Claire’s response to my question
      23 and 27a Can’t think of any clues without giving the answers
      14d When a lease has ended
      17d When someone is trying to persuade you to do something that you probably shouldn’t!
      24d Another word for odd or spooky that, to me at least, has a more usual spelling – perhaps I’m wrong.

      • Peter
        Posted May 22, 2010 at 4:04 pm | Permalink

        Well I cannot do SW corner. 16d anyone?

      • Michael
        Posted May 22, 2010 at 4:19 pm | Permalink

        23a The first two words define the answer, the rest of the clue gives an alternative two word phrase which concatenate. As said above try discovery instead of decision.

        27a “on edge” is literal here. Minor is in the sense of not so important.

        • Peter
          Posted May 23, 2010 at 4:57 am | Permalink

          Thanks again. Finished now. Some of these seem tenuous to me.

  14. Geoff
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 2:17 pm | Permalink

    All done, no small thanks to Kath’s hints and Tilly’s link to the rather useful Word Wizard – thanks for those! Nice to finish one this week …

  15. Robbo
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 2:57 pm | Permalink

    Hi All, down to the last one and stuck on 22d – any hints would be appreciated please?

    • gazza
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 3:12 pm | Permalink

      22d One taking a lot of interest to be certain in old city (6)
      The definition is one taking a lot of interest (i.e. someone who wants an extortionate rate of return for lending money). Put a synonym for certain inside the most famous (in Crosswordland at least) old biblical city.

    • Michael
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 3:29 pm | Permalink

      Think Merchant of Venice

  16. Robbo
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 3:26 pm | Permalink

    Thanks Gazza – think I was suffering from brain ache!
    Thats it then – off to the garden with a cold beer seems the thing to do now

  17. Michael
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 3:34 pm | Permalink

    I liked 2d and 16d best. Also 28a.

    I did not like 15a (steal?), 23a (decision?), or 17d

    • Peter
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 4:05 pm | Permalink

      Um.

      Hints for 26d please/?

  18. Peter
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 5:40 pm | Permalink

    Sorry.

    I meant 16d

    • prolixic
      Posted May 22, 2010 at 5:45 pm | Permalink

      You want a device that goes bang (will give a report) after a set period.

  19. Little Dave
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 6:07 pm | Permalink

    Eureka! Got 9a at last. Too much sunshine in Hertfordshire, obviously. Off for a chilled burgundy as a reward.

    It’s ready to post.

  20. mark
    Posted May 22, 2010 at 7:21 pm | Permalink

    Did some of this before going away for the weekend. Have therefore left mother and father in law to finish it! Thanks for the hints Dave!

  21. bobness
    Posted May 23, 2010 at 2:52 pm | Permalink

    Got off to a flyer on this one, but became mired, and had the wrong answer for 9a.
    Not sure about 23a, 6d and 17d are just not my type of clue, and joined up by the similar 17a, I had a big blank Z shape for ages!
    20a pleased me as I worked out the answer having never heard the word. We had a similar one last week on holiday with “Stabat Mater”.

  22. JohnF
    Posted May 23, 2010 at 7:25 pm | Permalink

    Hi bobness – bet you put ‘pretence’ like me – and then spent ages getting the correct answer! I’ve just got 17d and 17a to do [assuming others are correct] – any clues gratefully received!

    • gazza
      Posted May 23, 2010 at 7:33 pm | Permalink

      Hi JohnF – welcome to the blog.
      Kath has given hints to 17a and 17d in reply to comment #13 above,

  23. Alex
    Posted May 24, 2010 at 2:28 pm | Permalink

    HI may i ask what the Saturday Crossword Club is? thankyou

    • Posted May 24, 2010 at 2:52 pm | Permalink

      Welcome to the blog Alex

      The Saturday Crossword Club is just my way of making the Saturday hints post into a friendly forum!

    • Alex
      Posted May 24, 2010 at 4:55 pm | Permalink

      Thanks for the welcome Dave :)

      Just came across the site when i was struggling with a clue for the online DT crossword.

      I am a regular visitor now :) Keep up the good work

      Any idea when Anax going to submit his 2nd installment of the ‘Compiler’s Guide’?? I am looking forward to it.

      PS yeah it seems a friendly forum :) Hope my posts don’t upset that equilibrium :p

      • alex
        Posted May 24, 2010 at 4:57 pm | Permalink

        lol

        might help if i read some of the other posts to get the answer :)

      • Posted May 24, 2010 at 5:24 pm | Permalink

        We are hoping to have one chapter a week – watch this space!

        • alex
          Posted May 24, 2010 at 5:42 pm | Permalink

          wow Great

          or ‘Mad, loco hippy! (4)’ lol my rather feeble attempt an an abstruse all-in-one clue :)

          By the way Dave, is there any way i can log in without having to type my particulars each time i post?

          • Posted May 24, 2010 at 5:47 pm | Permalink

            This is a recent problem to which I am still trying to find a solution. If you acquire a WordPress logon – free from WordPress, instructions in the FAQ – you should be able to stay logged on all the time.

            • alex
              Posted May 24, 2010 at 5:49 pm | Permalink

              ok will look into it

              Thanks a bundle D